Tuesday, February 16, 2010

Horse Killers Are Welcome at Westminster- Go, AKC...



So, ScienceGirl told me that the winner of the non sporting group at the Westminster dog show this year was a French Bulldog.

Not that I care, although they are funny- they look as though they just saw a mirror.

But the second half of the information made ME look like a French Bulldog!

Its owner is Marion Hulick.

Yes, horse killer and thief Marion Hulick.

Suspended for life by the AHSA Marion Hulick.

(Yes, its the same Marion Hulick, suspended for life might not mean so much.)


It seems that the AKC is interested in dogs only- consilience isn't in its lexicon. I suppose as long as she didn't do anything to dogs, the rest of her life is no concern of the Kennel Club's.

I'm not surprised, it took the AHSA a looooong time and a big fight before they were driven to sort of suspend child porn pervert Jonathan Soresi ...

I expect to get a lot of noise about this, so here is my point. Anyone in the horse show, or dog show, or art, or (name of leisure profession) knows that there is plenty of very sharp practice going on. All the various guilds talk about policing themselves and trying to enhance or protect the integrity of their markets. Oh, sorry, I meant sports.

It surprises me not a bit that Mrs. Hulick is still showing dogs. The AKC is so far disconnected from ordinary people that it will be amazed that there is any notice taken at all. That's why I posted the ten pages of Chronicle posts, showing how the AHSA couldn't comprehend that people were disturbed that a child porn convict was at the horse shows.

It's not as though Mrs. Hulick wanted to play football, we know how the AKC feels about that. They have told us that the NFL has "a moral obligation to investigate and punish... players who may have knowledge of, or who may be involved in, these atrocious acts of animal cruelty."

In fact, "This activity is anathema to everything the American Kennel Club stands for, and the millions of AKC registrants and competitors, many of whom have been NFL fans, unilaterally condemn it and those who perpetrated it.

It is common for state laws to recommend the immediate suspension of a teacher when charged with certain crimes. To acknowledge the severity of Mr. Vick’s charges, we urge his immediate suspension."


Big talk, with Mrs. Hulick smiling and nodding at ringside. No, hold hard- it's only dog killing football players who should be deprived of their livelihoods.

Horse killing thief dog owners' amusements shouldn't be trifled with.

(Don't get me wrong, I hold no brief for Mr. Vick. Nor am I a Petan- owning, using, eating, and killing animals are no problem for me. Anyone who reads this blog- all sixteen of you- know that lots of people would hang the three of us to the same tree.)

But I don't assert one rule and follow another. The standards that put Mr. Vick beyond redemption in the eyes of the AKC ought to apply to its own members too.


If I were a reporter, I'd find the show superintendent, put a microphone and camera on him, and ask straight up, "Look over there- she's a woman who killed horses for insurance fraud. There she sits, an exhibitor here. Is that alright with the AKC, or are you going to tell her to leave?"

COMMENTS- Fifty comments! A record for me by a looooong way.

They quickly degenerated into pro/con rants about the handler of this dog. I've published everything so far, because I thought the craziness might be illuminating to non dog show people like me.

As one commenter said, they really inspire people to show dogs.

But from now on, I'll delete comments that are off topic to the original post, which was about Marion Hulick, Michael Vick, and the AKC's choices.

59 comments:

Anonymous said...

If this is true and this is the right Marion Hulick, it is nothing short of sickening and appalling. I wonder if these dog people know?

And what about the AKC? One would think that the AKC would do background checks on people involved with their organization to ensure that their name is not drug through the mud.

Anonymous said...

I only hope James Dalton doesn't have Bru insured or he may end up with an extension cord up his butt like Charisma (the horse Marion Hulick set up for execution).

Anonymous said...

This IS the same Marion Hulick, She should not be allowed in the sport of dogs. Just like a child Molester cannnot live near a school, she has been suspended for life from the AHSA for the murder of show horses. Hopefully Westminster group winner Fabelhaft I'm on Fire will behave himself or he too might be killed, I wonder what will become of his life when he no longer serves a purpose for his filthy owners. All the French Bulldog folks are afraid to say anything as they might be sued or killed, or maybe killed, then sued.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

The ONLY pet Marion Hulick should be allowed to own is a "pet rock!"

Anonymous said...

This is so typical in the sport of dogs - the general public has NO idea the dirty deals made to get these show dogs into the top rankings! Everyone knew who Hulick was the day she bought her first Frenchie - i say shame on those breeders who courted this woman into our breed and who will continue to support her unless there is MUCH public outcry! Why is it that one person convicted of animal cruelty has their AKC privledges revoked for life, while another is courted by the fancy and permitted by AKC to own/breed?

Anonymous said...

AND the handler, Perry Pason, breeds and shows arabian horses!!! he can't say he didn't know about marion hulick's past - he was confronted by one brave sole at the national specialty last october about this issue. so too late to back pedal now!

Anonymous said...

There is a book written on this whole horse murder for money situation, it is called "Hot Blood" by Ken Englade. It is available at Amazon.com

Also read the corresponding legal transcript from the trial:

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/cgi-bin/getcase.pl?court=7th&navby=case&no=961188

You may have to cut and paste the above into your browser

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
staghounds said...

Marion Hulick is nobody's victim. I laughed when I read that she blamed little George Lindemann, who at that time wouldn't have taken a single step without Marion's command.

And I would LIKE to think that the people around her didn't know about this. Just as I'd LIKE to think I'll win that lottery. But in truth, they did- as a commenter said, she is "epic" in the horse world.

And what you say about these handlers could be said about many, if not most, professionals in the amusement animal trades. Like art dealers, they are in competition with each other only secondarily. They are mainly in competition with YOU, the customer, for your money.

Anonymous said...

AKC has no concerns about their reputation. They are too busy worrying about how to keep the puppy mills in business so their revenues don't decline any further.

That said, their head of Public Relations is Ms Christina Duffney (cmd@akc.org). I just wrote to her to tell her what I thought and you should all do the same!

Anne

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

Maybe we should just take the Amish approach and "shun" them. Do not breed to them, buy a puppy from them, etc.. I do think everyone should voice their disgust to the AKC. If people are afraid to do this individually then they should stand strong as a club (each breed)and make their voices heard!

Anonymous said...

you all need to get a life. it is quite apparent that most of you dont know Perry Payson at all. The man would give you the shirt off his back if you needed it. I have had him handle multiple dogs for me and I will never send my dogs with anyone else. He is gentle, compassionate and LOVES his dogs. His horse world is limited so His "knowledge" of this 20 year old crime is limited as well. Do your homeowrk and math. Perry was not in horses then. As for you Jill (yes we know who you are) perhaps if James did not have to sue your pathetic ass over the collection of his stud dog, which you had no right to collest, you wouldnt be so bitter. As for the rest of you..Jealous of the Robobull breeding program is all I see. Shelly St. John has a heart of gold....James is the business man. Oh yeah you forgot all that..Its a business. Of dogs. Not horses. got over it.

Anonymous said...

really people? Does anyone of you even know Perry Payson, Shelley StJohn, James Dalton, or Marion. Perhaps you should do your homeowrk. Marion has never owned the dog Bru..she was just the finances to get Bru campaigned...If you are a fancier you would know this or at least have some knowledge of it...and since when do horses have anything to do with dogs? Further more Perry is in to Arabians, not hunter jumpers and race horses. The two are not related so it is not far fetched to consider that Perry Paysons may have had limited knowledge of Marions Past of hmmmm 20 years or so... Did she not pay for her crime? Shall we convict her for the rest of her life. There are two sides to every story so before you go around and cast stones perhaps you should call Marion and ask what she has to say about it. As for Robobull, there is a reason Shelly has been breeder of the year multiple times...enough said. You naysayers can spew all you want about this group, but I for one will be the first to purchase a frenchie and or rottie from them...thats if I want a dog who will win, be healthy, and supported no matter what from the very same people you condemn. grow up and move on...oh and I know who you are and beleive me the AKC will hear about you and your lawsuit. collecting dogs without approval. shame shame shame

Anonymous said...

just as I thought...you wont post a reply to the garbage posted. Typical of people like you. crawl back under the rock for whence you came..

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
staghounds said...

1. According to the AKCs own web published result,Hulick, St. John, and Dalton are the owners. Click on the first link in the post.

2. "Perry Paysons may have had limited knowledge of Marions Past"

He knows now, doesnt he?

3. "ask what she has to say about it."

The New York Post did- read my post of Feb. 17. She blames George Lindemann, which s like Bill Clinton blaming Monica Lewinsky.

4. "when do horses have anything to do with dogs?"

About the same time football has anything to do with dogs. The AKC saw plenty of connection there.

Look, the AKC is welcome to the whole world of dog shows. It can do what it likes. I just wanted to point out the inconsistency I saw between the AKC's stated goals, its conduct toward Vick, and the presence of Hulick as an exhibitor at Westminster.

Either they don't mind her exhibiting, or they do. But if they, and her co owners, and her handlers, and the people who sit beside her at the dog shows do nothing, they can't hide behind saying they don't know what she did.

Yes, she did it twenty years ago. Yes, she paid her criminal penalty.

If that doesn't bother you, or the AKC, fine.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

I think what bothers me is that, with all the hate in the world this is what you choose to blog about. isnt there enough pain. No-one really knows what went on twenty years ago in that horse barn except tha players involved. Besides what does any of that have to do with the little dog with a big heart winning at the garden. you may not like the breeders, the handlers, the backer, or the AKC but the fact still reamins. Bru showed his heart out...He has given the breed so much speed and all you people want to do is squash his thunder. what good will that do the breed or the sport? I will not pretend to know what goes on in the robobull/fablehaft camp, but I do know they breed excellent frenchies...the success of these dogs speak for themselves. I own one...and I dont care if she is flatfooted, high in the rear, or whatever else you may critique her as. She is the light in our world and makes me smile everyday...isnt that what dogs are about or have you all forgotten that. Shame on each one of you for tarnishing all of this with your own crap. A gift from god with the helo f these breeders ...are these animals. What gifts have you helped bring into the world? thats what i thought.

FrogDogz said...

I'm not really sure why everyone - on both sides - is hiding behind anonymous postings. I'd like to see a few more Frenchie people having the courage of their convictions. If everyone is too afraid to speak their minds, then nothing will ever be accomplished.

Personally, I would put a lot more credence into the claim that Marion should be forgiven because this was all 'in the past' if this was something she'd done when she was 19 or 20. She wasn't, however - she was a grown woman of 60, with the resources to walk away from her employment if what she was asked to do truly offended her morals and her ethics. She didn't, she chose to stay, and to take part.

I also wonder if the people who are defending her as a good person and great dog owner would still be doing so if it had been a FRENCH BULLDOG she had helped to electrocute for the insurance money.

I happen to respect some of the people who've co owned dogs with Marion, which makes all of this so much more baffling. I know and believe that they DO care about their dogs. I imagine that they had their own reasons - they're just not ones I can manage to understand.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

AGAIN SHE LOVES HER DOGS AND THE SPORT, WHICH YOU ARE APARENTLY TRYING TO SUCK THE JOY OUT OF.

You've posted three totally idiotic rambling posts -- perhaps you should stop before you spiral out of control. And you should invest in a spell and grammar checker

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

Yes there was a murder of a human being involved people!

The disappearance of fabulously rich Chicago candy heiress Helen Brach and the suspicious deaths of a string of champion racehorses are linked in a celebrated scandal that has reverberated through every level of the glamorous enclaves of thoroughbred horse breeding. When widowed heiress Helen Brach suddenly disappeared on the morning of February 17, 1977, after a visit to the Mayo Clinic, she left behind a lavender Rolls-Royce, Cadillacs in red, pink, and coral, an eighteen-room mansion, and a fortune now estimated at 75 million. She also left behind a mystery that would tantalize investigators for years. When Assistant U.S. Attorney Steven Miller assigned himself the challenge of solving the Brach case, he never imagined an investigation of the horse world would lead to a charming gigolo named Richard Bailey, who made a career of romancing wealthy women out of huge sums of money, a shadowy figure called The Sandman, who made his living by killing priceless horses so that their owners could collect insurance, and the ghastly murder of three children in 1955.
Publishers Weekly

In February 1977, Helen Vorhees Brach, the widowed heiress to the Brach candy fortune, vanished without a trace shortly after leaving the Mayo Clinic in Minnesota. Despite the efforts of law enforcement officials as well as those of private investigators, the Brach case appeared to be at a dead end until 12 years later, when U.S. attorney Steven Miller was persuaded to look into the growing accusations of fraud against Richard Bailey and Bailey's possible involvement in Brach's disappearance. Miller's investigation soon discovered that Bailey was a con man whose modus operandi was to charm older, rich women into buying thoroughbred horses at prices far above market value. One of those women was Helen Brach, who, suspecting that she had been swindled, threatened to have Bailey prosecuted but disappeared before she could act. While exploring the Bailey-Brach link, Miller discovered that a number of Bailey's associates were involved in the killing of horses for insurance money. With a mountain of evidence against them, Bailey and 20 others pleaded guilty to several crimes associated with the murder of horses and insurance fraud. Two people who chose to fight the charges were MARION HULICK and her employer, George Lindemann Jr., the son of one of America's richest men; both were convicted of conspiracy in the murder of Lindemann's horse, Charisma. Englade (Beyond Reason) is at his best when detailing the life and crimes of Bailey, a colorful if detestable human being. The story becomes more routine when he relates the Lindemann trial proceedings. Nevertheless, this fast-paced tale will have readers wondering what did happen to Helen Brach, a question the author never fully answers.

Anonymous said...

Wow. so much hostility. I am sure the "Dalton Gang" is quite happy with all the energy you have given this....You all should be so proud of the contribution you are making towards the decline in AKC events and registrations. I am sure this makes the fancy so appealing to newbies.

Anonymous said...

I am sure this makes the fancy so appealing to newbies...........

At least they will know who to avoid!!!
There are many honest good hear-ted breeders out there that would treat their puppy buyers with human respect.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Mark Pastin said...

I have dealt with Mr. Dalton for years and proudly own five of his puppies. My business is the ethics business and I can tell you that Mr. Dalton is one of the most ethical breeders and people I have known. This attempt at guilt by association is revealed as what it is by the fact that the posters are anonymous - brave souls. And who is to say what their interests in all of this are? Are they jealous competitors or what? Since they are not confident enough in what they say to come forward, it is hard to know what axe they are grinding - but I would bet on an axe or two. I understand that this is a competitive business and that many will try to undermine the achievement on behalf of all Frenchies and Frenchy breeders by Bru's great win across all non-sporting. So what is the point? Bru is Bru and doesn't judge his owners. Mr. Dalton has produced yet another winner. He also produces well adjusted healthy, sweat dogs. If you are not yourself wealthy, you need supporters. If we judged presidents by their financial supporters, none would be allowed to show a dog. This is nonsense in my view. Mark Pastin

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

Why hasn't this really hit the mainstrem media?

Christina Brecto said...

These comments are so crazy. It takes money to be in any business - as a neophyte looking at the dog show world it makes sense that ads would be placed, people to back a dogs campaign, etc., and this is common in the purebred dog world. Nobody has a gun to their heads when they sign these agreements. That would lead us to believe that everyone who signs a contract co-owning a dog and to campaign it are a bunch of morons who don't read the fine print in the contract. And, could it be economy driven that people leave after 3 years? I don't know the dog show world, but whoever keeps blogging anonymously with invective, must be aware that they appear to be lodging a smear campaign without any responsibility for their OWN behavior. If you feel so strongly that YOU have been wronged or disagree, let the world know who you are on this blog. It would certainly carry more weight than "Anonymous". I am sure that my comments will be ripped apart as I don't agree with people who want to hurt others anonymously. Show some class.....

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Ridgelover said...

If AKC did a background check on everyone involved in pure-bred dogs, half the people would probably be ineligible. It's ludicrous to think that AKC has any responsibility in checking backgrounds.

That said, what this woman did was horrendous. Saying that she blamed her "young" boss when she, herself, was 55 years old when it happened is a cop out and not a worthy defense. She's no better than Michael Vick, and I'll bet she rues the day that her Frenchie won the group at Westminster thereby shining a very heavy candle on her previous nefarious activity.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
FrogDogz said...

If you were credible or the information was not simply malicious libelous nonsense you should have no fear to identify yourself

Am I the only one finding it ironic that now the anonymous posters are bitching about comments made by other anonymous posters?

Jesus, people. You can sign your name. It's not the end of the world to proclaim your opinion.

Mark Pastin said...

I did not state my business to impress you whoever or whatever you are. I don't care about impressing people who will not own their own ground. I would rather be a member of the "Dalton gang" than a gang hiding in white hoods with narrow eye slits. Come out of hiding or clam up. Ethically here is what really disgusts me. No one who cares about animals and their correct treatment would exploit this issue to grind a personal axe. For shame.

Mark Pastin said...

I am not part of this dog show business at all so watch your Ps and Qs before slandering me - such as comparing me to Bernie Madoff. You have my name and you used it. So when you defame me, your anonymous signature does not protect you. So here it is. I just love Frenchies and, to be honest, all other dogs, cats, horses and creatures, pure bred or not. And my personal experience over many years with James Dalton tells me he is a good guy who really loves his puppies beyond all reason. I like him judged on my low level experience of having had my life enriched by his very well bred dogs. These dogs are not bred to show per se. They are bred to be happy, healthy critters who tend to the love machine side of the scale. If you could meet these dogs, you would know what little gems they are. I do not like puppy millers, animal torturers, cowards or anyone who tries to hurt decent and honest people while hiding from their own actions. You won't sign your names because you fear being found out for who and what you are. Now it doesn't take a professional ethicist to figure that out does it?

Anonymous said...

Dr. Pastin,
I believe you misread my post. I in no way shape or form compared you to Bernie Madoff. I know your credentials and you have every reason to be proud of your work. The reference wrt Bernie Madoff was to show that even the most educated and well meaning people can be fooled by a slick individual or group.

And while your experience with Mr. Dalton has been good, there are many many out there who's experiences HAVE NOT been good. Please give them the courtesy of respecting them and what they have endured.

Anonymous said...

If Michael Vick were to co-own a race horse, even 20 years from now, which has nothing to do with dogs, what would the horse world have to say?
I reckon it would have the same reaction.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
dee smith said...

WOW. You all should be so proud..this makes me want to get into showing dogs right now..this minute. lol

Anonymous said...

just as I thought...you wont post a reply to the garbage posted. Typical of people like you. crawl back under the rock for whence you came..

See how he treats people? This sentence says it all.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
dee smith said...

see how who treats people? Now I am confused. goodbye everyone..this has gotten quite boring and old. I use to read this blog all the time, but no more. There are more entertaining things to do...

Anonymous said...

I would have to agree with the comments about the "Gang". Having had one of their dogs and being seriously less than satisfied with the health of the dog. The response to my concerns were met with NO responsibilty on his behalf. I am now personna non grata because of my concerns and lack of huge pocketbook. I will no longer think of them as anything but a money machine that lacks concern for the health of the animals they produce or their clients. I have seen the lack of concern and responsibilty first hand. They are not the only show in town or are they even the best. Although James sure thinks he is.

As far as Marion goes. I feel she has made a terrible mistake in her life and has paid for it. Are we all proud of everything we have ever done? Would you like it to follow you forever. If you cant tolerate her or her past than dont deal with her. There is only one more judge she will have to face.

As far as me being one of the above mentioned people I am not. I am just one of many who have been less then awed with Fablehaft.

staghounds said...

The blog isn't off the subject, because there isn't one. But the comments to this post are, because there is. I've published everything so far, because the craziness might be illuminating to non dog show people.

As one commenter said, they really inspire people to show dogs.

But from now on, I'll delete comments that are off topic to the original post, which was about Marion Hulick, Michael Vick, and the AKC.

Anonymous said...

staghounds..I agree with your post but you really need to edit/remove all comments not directly related to the public records of michael vick,marion hulick or AKC.

your fifty posts are from a small number of people who have used this blog as an opportunity to slander and libel others.
You have an interesting blog with many other great topics and most of us are tired of reading this one.You are aware that these comments are libelous.
I doubt anyone other than this small group would give this the time of day.you have many more interesting subjects on your blog so I hope in the interests of fairplay you will consider limiting this post to only micheal vick,marion hulick and akc and remove the rest.Thats what would keep me coming back to your blogsite.

Anonymous said...

Those who truly love animals do not torture or murder them, nor do they associate with those who do.

Anonymous said...

Thank you for taking this back to the original topic...that of the horse killer and her presence in the dog world.
I am sickened and disgusted that ANYONE would ask her to co-own, even if it is just for the money. If these people are so "well respected" and have such great dogs, can't they find someone to back their dogs that hasn't set up the electrocution of innocent animals for money?? Maybe they aren't as highly thought of as they would like us to believe.

While I am happy that this woman has been exposed for exactly what she is, it has tainted the dog show community as a whole.

staghounds said...

No, I don't believe that her presence taints the dog show business.

Because the AKC can say it had no idea. Her presence and her past were "unknown at the time".

But her continued presence, and AKC inaction, is a different matter. As I said in the post, a horse killing thief is either not permitted to exhibit, or she is just fine with the AKC.

Is it all right with the AKC, or will they tell her to leave?

horse blogs said...

I doubt anyone other than this small group would give this the time of day.you have many more interesting subjects on your blog so I hope in the interests of fairplay you will consider limiting this post to only micheal vick,marion hulick and akc and remove the rest.Thats what would keep me coming back to your blogsite.

LISA said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
staghounds said...

Done, L.

Anonymous said...

As a young girl, I attended a summer riding camp owned by Marion Hulick and her husband. Like all the young girls in attendance, I adored horses and the sport. I also adored the Hulicks. When I read of her crimes in the not-too-distant past, I was sickened. This was someone I looked up to and represented the best of horsemanship in the eyes of a young girl. Her cruel, appalling and self-serving mistreatment of animals should prohibit her from any public and private interaction with animals. I am greatly dissapointed in the AKC.

osprey said...

Marion Hulick should not be allowed to participate in any show animal events. Period.
Her conviction 14 years ago should follow her forever in regards to these type of events.
The defect that enables people to kill a horse for insurance fraud would not somehow magically make them
act morally toward other animals.

And yes, I did know Hulick years ago.